PANINI Barclays Women's Super League 23/24

[ellisdee]

Most people who are following Panini UK on twitter, will have found out today that they are bringing out the women's Premier League collection in December.

PANINI Barclays Women's Super League

I was just wondering if it was too controversial to merge the two together for the new Panini Premier League 2024 one.

I personally think Panini need to update their contents now, as it has always been the same, since the albums 1st came back.

 

[Guinness]

To be honest, this is a pure joke, nothing more but forcing something that should come natural. But ok, that's just me. WWC and WEC are ok but this... I mean c'mon, there are numerous European legaue with much more popularity in their own respective countries and also I think the copyrights and licenses are much lower for those leagues then this.

 

[byoplayer]

The album of Spanish Women's League was very good and very well received. I think it would be the same here

 

[dantzig]

Most people who are following Panini UK on twitter, will have found out today that they are bringing out the women's Premier League collection in December.

PANINI Barclays Women's Super League

I was just wondering if it was too controversial to merge the two together for the new Panini Premier League 2024 one.

I personally think Panini need to update their contents now, as it has always been the same, since the albums 1st came back.

I don't think it was about controversy but more of too much to one album... even if Panini change anything, the male PL sticker album is always big enough to add anything else and the women football definitely deserve more than a couple of pages and some dozens of stickers from top players.

To be honest, this is a pure joke, nothing more but forcing something that should come natural. But ok, that's just me. WWC and WEC are ok but this... I mean c'mon, there are numerous European legaue with much more popularity in their own respective countries and also I think the copyrights and licenses are much lower for those leagues then this.

I don't think they are forcing anything, it seems quite natural now after the England ladies became euro champions and almost world champions.

Don't underestimate the english love for football... Currently England is a powerhouse in every football department, their women football league matches are always very supported, just like everything related to football... and if spanish women league album sold well, the english one will definitely sell too.

As for the other leagues... do you vouch that those "numerous leagues with much more popularity" will sell as well as anything in England? I get what you mean by costs being lower than England, but will sales have enough profit to be worth investing? If something cost me 10 and I can sell for estimate 20, but another cost me 50 and I can sell for estimate 100, then I won't waste my time just to get extra 10 when for the same time I can definitely get 5x more.

And let's not forget Panini is well established in the UK, much easier for them to pick this and have a decent profit while advertising the rising women football... My two cents on the matter anyway.

 

[Hoddle01]

To be honest, this is a pure joke, nothing more but forcing something that should come natural. But ok, that's just me. WWC and WEC are ok but this... I mean c'mon, there are numerous European legaue with much more popularity in their own respective countries and also I think the copyrights and licenses are much lower for those leagues then this.

That's pretty offensive to be honest. The women's game is here to stay and is growing in popularity every year. Why not have a sticker album?

 

[Burkina2008]

Growing in popularity because in the past there was nobody watching it and now there are a few people...the album in Spain was a flop and will not be re-issued next year. The is on average a higher attendance on the Conference League than in the Womens Premier League...and I dont see any album for Championship, Skybet One or Two.

Lets not confuse the excitement of a good run on a WC in a year where there was no other relevant competition besides that and women football being popular.

Its going to be the same as WNBA, as much as you push it, there is a small cap to people that would prefer to watch women football (which quality wise even on World Cup level cant even rival an U17 Mens world cup.

 

[Hoddle01]

Well, we'll see. Women's football is now given the same coverage as men's league football, outside of the Prem, and it will get bigger. I've supported the women's game for the last 10 to 15 years and the progress has been both impressive and deserved.

Anyway, if Panini don't try and give this collection a go, we'll never know. I've read that the collection in Spain was popular. If they aren't producing a second one on the back of their world cup success, I find that strange.

 

[dantzig]

Growing in popularity because in the past there was nobody watching it and now there are a few people...the album in Spain was a flop and will not be re-issued next year. The is on average a higher attendance on the Conference League than in the Womens Premier League...and I dont see any album for Championship, Skybet One or Two.

Lets not confuse the excitement of a good run on a WC in a year where there was no other relevant competition besides that and women football being popular.

Its going to be the same as WNBA, as much as you push it, there is a small cap to people that would prefer to watch women football (which quality wise even on World Cup level cant even rival an U17 Mens world cup.

There were Championship albums in the past, never dwelved into why Panini/Topps didn't further bet on it (lack of interest)... but don't forget that those licenses should still be much more expensive than any women football license.

You sure Liga F will not have another season? Spain became (surprisingly) world champions and even if it's sadly remembered for what we know, I think the spanish audience will gladly welcome another collection... unless the natural "machismo" incorporated in our latin blood comes into play

What people still need to understand is to not constantly compare with men's football. If you keep doing that, you won't ever appreciate women football. It has a different pace + mentality and only seeing the best in competitions like UCL and WC kinda resembles a bit the men's football.

So if you apply this logic to collections, we have to understand and accept that women football sales will never be the same as men football sales. This means you shouldn't pursue these women collections? No way, there's still a niche that will love it, so why not explore it but produce it at a lower level?

I won't deny that some "entities" entered women football just because it would look good on them (all the talk about equality and such) or solely looking for profit, but the players and federations have been doing some tremendous works to make it enjoyable.

 

[Burkina2008]

There were Championship albums in the past, never dwelved into why Panini/Topps didn't further bet on it (lack of interest)... but don't forget that those licenses should still be much more expensive than any women football license.

You sure Liga F will not have another season? Spain became (surprisingly) world champions and even if it's sadly remembered for what we know, I think the spanish audience will gladly welcome another collection... unless the natural "machismo" incorporated in our latin blood comes into play

What people still need to understand is to not constantly compare with men's football. If you keep doing that, you won't ever appreciate women football. It has a different pace + mentality and only seeing the best in competitions like UCL and WC kinda resembles a bit the men's football.

So if you apply this logic to collections, we have to understand and accept that women football sales will never be the same as men football sales. This means you shouldn't pursue these women collections? No way, there's still a niche that will love it, so why not explore it but produce it at a lower level?

I won't deny that some "entities" entered women football just because it would look good on them (all the talk about equality and such) or solely looking for profit, but the players and federations have been doing some tremendous works to make it enjoyable.

Yes I am sure. Panini unfortunately is under tremendous financial preassure, as they are being sued left and right, already having paid settlments in the US to the tune of the tens of millions. The Spanish album was well recieved among the collector community but did not gather any tracking on the kids/WCandEurocasuals, meaning that it did not turn any real profit and all those projects will be scratched.

It is true that the Womans game is growing due to those initiatives that are basically (again like the WNBA) subsidized by the Men's revenue. Like the WNBA, the womans game is never going to be profitable as even women in general that like sports prefer the "real thing".

I am sorry but this growth is just based on some virtue signaling which will be gone in the next years when money dries up...

Btw just continuing on the average attendance. Arsenal Women are the only ones with a good attendance, but almost half of the teams in the Woman premier league have attendances below 1000 people (including Tottenham for example), so you can gather from there how many people would watch those games if they were not included in some EPL subscription and only when the other football options at the same time are like the second divison of Cyprus or the OFC champions league...

 

[dantzig]

Yes I am sure. Panini unfortunately is under tremendous financial preassure, as they are being sued left and right, already having paid settlments in the US to the tune of the tens of millions. The Spanish album was well recieved among the collector community but did not gather any tracking on the kids/WCandEurocasuals, meaning that it did not turn any real profit and all those projects will be scratched.

It is true that the Womans game is growing due to those initiatives that are basically (again like the WNBA) subsidized by the Men's revenue. Like the WNBA, the womans game is never going to be profitable as even women in general that like sports prefer the "real thing".

I am sorry but this growth is just based on some virtue signaling which will be gone in the next years when money dries up...

Btw just continuing on the average attendance. Arsenal Women are the only ones with a good attendance, but almost half of the teams in the Woman premier league have attendances below 1000 people (including Tottenham for example), so you can gather from there how many people would watch those games if they were not included in some EPL subscription and only when the other football options at the same time are like the second divison of Cyprus or the OFC champions league...

I wouldn't be so sure anyway, for that reason Panini would only release world cups or the best leagues, as those ones are really the only ones with good profit... Yet, I'm still seeing Panini releasing the usual tons of cartoon albums and even getting new leagues like the greek one.

We all know how the men's revenue supports the women football, it's no secret. But you can't expect women football to suddendly have it's own profit out of the blue, it takes investment, time, patience, commitment... they deserve that chance and if the men have to pay for it, so be it, they already earn too much for what they are worth anyway, as we live in a disgraceful speculation era where a snotty kid that suddendly scores a vital goal is suddendly labeled as the next wonderkid and sold by hundreds of millions to some oil club.

As for attendances, Arsenal has an amazing attendance this season, I'm seeing 3x more than last season... can you guarantee this won't happen on other clubs, with the right initiatives, proper support and most importantly, changing mentalities? I can also tell you that this year, we had attendances records here... it would even be unthinkable to see a women match to gather thousands and thousands, even if it's a Benfica vs Sporting... also, the national team has been rising fast, whoever thought we could almost knock out the world champions or recently winning against one of the first powerhouses of the women game like Norway?

Heck, I'm not a diehard supporter for the women football, I barely even watch matches where Portugal or Sporting are not playing, but all I'm saying is that the chances are being given and unlike the men's football, where millions are stupidly spent to satisfy egos, they have not been wasted at all.

 

[LeicesterRob]

I just wish Panini would give us the 1980s style albums we had in UK that covered all 4 leagues + Scotland too, which could give plenty of room for women's football too.

And if they were ambitious they'd include the non-league right down to Brackley's league in the National League North!

Now that would be a tomb of an album!

If I'm correct, I believe to watch the Leicester women's team is about £2.50 per match if you buy a men's season ticket.

 

[dantzig]

I just wish Panini would give us the 1980s style albums we had in UK that covered all 4 leagues + Scotland too, which could give plenty of room for women's football too.

And if they were ambitious they'd include the non-league right down to Brackley's league in the National League North!

Now that would be a tomb of an album!

If I'm correct, I believe to watch the Leicester women's team is about £2.50 per match if you buy a men's season ticket.

Calciatori style, right? Must be easy for Panini to deal with italians to add lower tiers in their sticker album but probably not the same in England.

A nice initiative from Leicester too... I believe here some bigger clubs even have free attendance just to bring more and more supporters... because why not? Better to have 10k no paying tickets but paying for beverages, food, parking, jerseys, etc, than less than 1k paying tickets, even if it's cheap... Old school teams like Belenenses and Leiria here, which had terrible times, are now rising again with these type of initiatives... that's real football for me.

 

[Hoddle01]

I wouldn't be so sure anyway, for that reason Panini would only release world cups or the best leagues, as those ones are really the only ones with good profit... Yet, I'm still seeing Panini releasing the usual tons of cartoon albums and even getting new leagues like the greek one.

We all know how the men's revenue supports the women football, it's no secret. But you can't expect women football to suddendly have it's own profit out of the blue, it takes investment, time, patience, commitment... they deserve that chance and if the men have to pay for it, so be it, they already earn too much for what they are worth anyway, as we live in a disgraceful speculation era where a snotty kid that suddendly scores a vital goal is suddendly labeled as the next wonderkid and sold by hundreds of millions to some oil club.

As for attendances, Arsenal has an amazing attendance this season, I'm seeing 3x more than last season... can you guarantee this won't happen on other clubs, with the right initiatives, proper support and most importantly, changing mentalities? I can also tell you that this year, we had attendances records here... it would even be unthinkable to see a women match to gather thousands and thousands, even if it's a Benfica vs Sporting... also, the national team has been rising fast, whoever thought we could almost knock out the world champions or recently winning against one of the first powerhouses of the women game like Norway?

Heck, I'm not a diehard supporter for the women football, I barely even watch matches where Portugal or Sporting are not playing, but all I'm saying is that the chances are being given and unlike the men's football, where millions are stupidly spent to satisfy egos, they have not been wasted at all.

I do think Burkina is somewhat naive when it comes to his assessment of the women's game. The ladies are going nowhere, and the women's game will grow and grow.

 

[Burkina2008]

I do think Burkina is somewhat naive when it comes to his assessment of the women's game. The ladies are going nowhere, and the women's game will grow and grow.

No it will not, for two main reasons:

1 - Time spent watching sports is limited and for most people "full", meaning that in order to grow you need to rob market share to some other sports/mens game. Also the revenue from EPL nowadays comes mostly from the outside market who does not care about women also due to culture.

2 - And most important, the same argument you had was made for the WNBA, 10-15 years ago. What happened? Well never turned profitable, after a while the initial sponsorships and virtue signaling began to desappear and attendances declined. The game is basically a mockery. And this is something that was backed up by one of the richest leagues in the world, in a sport where you dont even have the option to watch the men's game in the same months as the NBA because one is played in the winter and the other in the summer. So yes there will be die hard fans for sure that will remain but in 10 years it will be an afterthought

Basically a meme to do videos like these

 

[Hoddle01]

No it will not, for two main reasons:

1 - Time spent watching sports is limited and for most people "full", meaning that in order to grow you need to rob market share to some other sports/mens game. Also the revenue from EPL nowadays comes mostly from the outside market who does not care about women also due to culture.

2 - And most important, the same argument you had was made for the WNBA, 10-15 years ago. What happened? Well never turned profitable, after a while the initial sponsorships and virtue signaling began to desappear and attendances declined. The game is basically a mockery. And this is something that was backed up by one of the richest leagues in the world, in a sport where you dont even have the option to watch the men's game in the same months as the NBA because one is played in the winter and the other in the summer. So yes there will be die hard fans for sure that will remain but in 10 years it will be an afterthought

Basically a meme to do videos like these

I think you are totally wrong mate, but we'll see.

 

[dantzig]

I do think Burkina is somewhat naive when it comes to his assessment of the women's game. The ladies are going nowhere, and the women's game will grow and grow.

Nah, he's far from naive... Burkina had some interesting remarks, properly grounded, that we need to consider too... I'd say he's either pessimistic or bang on the issues... But like you, I'd say he will be wrong

No it will not, for two main reasons:

1 - Time spent watching sports is limited and for most people "full", meaning that in order to grow you need to rob market share to some other sports/mens game. Also the revenue from EPL nowadays comes mostly from the outside market who does not care about women also due to culture.

2 - And most important, the same argument you had was made for the WNBA, 10-15 years ago. What happened? Well never turned profitable, after a while the initial sponsorships and virtue signaling began to desappear and attendances declined. The game is basically a mockery. And this is something that was backed up by one of the richest leagues in the world, in a sport where you dont even have the option to watch the men's game in the same months as the NBA because one is played in the winter and the other in the summer. So yes there will be die hard fans for sure that will remain but in 10 years it will be an afterthought

Basically a meme to do videos like these

Just out of curiosity, I've checked WNBA attendances... and got this recent press release:

WNBA 2023 Season Delivers with Record-Breaking Viewership, Attendance and Digital Engagement - WNBA

The WNBA this year had its most-watched regular season in 21 years and its highest total attendance in 13 years.

www.wnba.com

EPL will always have full support from the english, the rest is just extra profit to keep paying outrageous wages... foreigners don't care for lower leagues and they have great attendances anyway.

You can't give up from the start and I'll say it again: the women football deserve a proper chance, believe in them and they will deliver within their own capabilities (but I'd say they have to forget the equality wages stuff, it's definitely unatainable)... don't have high expectations is the best, just grow little by little and not have a chinese/saudi mentality that everything is solved by rolling piles of money.

 

[Hoddle01]

Nah, he's far from naive... Burkina had some interesting remarks, properly grounded, that we need to consider too... I'd say he's either pessimistic or bang on the issues... But like you, I'd say he will be wrong



Just out of curiosity, I've checked WNBA attendances... and got this recent press release:

WNBA 2023 Season Delivers with Record-Breaking Viewership, Attendance and Digital Engagement - WNBA

The WNBA this year had its most-watched regular season in 21 years and its highest total attendance in 13 years.

www.wnba.com

EPL will always have full support from the english, the rest is just extra profit to keep paying outrageous wages... foreigners don't care for lower leagues and they have great attendances anyway.

You can't give up from the start and I'll say it again: the women football deserve a proper chance, believe in them and they will deliver within their own capabilities (but I'd say they have to forget the equality wages stuff, it's definitely unatainable)... don't have high expectations is the best, just grow little by little and not have a chinese/saudi mentality that everything is solved by rolling piles of money.

It was his total disregard for the women's game that I found both naive and offensive to be honest. Yes he raised some valid points, even if I did disagree with all of them.

 

[LeicesterRob]

So I'm wrong, at LCFC you don't need a men's season ticket to get the great price, you can get a season ticket for £42 for the women's team but I think there are other discounts to be had.

An afternoon watching football in a great stadium is always good

I don't think anyone is necessarily wrong in this thread and we shouldn't discount differing view points because it does not fit in with our thinking

I haven't been to a women's game yet but I'm sure I will do one day

If I can add a story I would like to add that I lost a lot of support for the PL men's seeing the players utterly not interested in the supporters. Basically the PL clubs no longer represents the local community and I fell out with my team.

So after I lost a lot of love for the club that I loved so much, I reduced my visits to almost nothing... then one match I'm jogging back from the ground and I see an LCFC fan (down's syndrome boy) with his family member and it made me snap right out of any resentment in a second.

That club I started to dislike is his World, he may not care about players earning stupid money like I did, he had just seen his team lose and I wanted them to win again just for him and to win for nobody else but him.

It's the same with women's football, my 14 year old son's friend plays in a girls team and is doing very well. She's got no interest in school but this has captured her. I hear she's very good.

One of my nieces plays too but is 135 miles away so I hope we'll get to watch her play over Christmas.

This is their world and having the sticker album is another great step into what is really a shrinking market (stickers that is).

Maybe it will help revive parts of the market and I've spoken to a few female collectors that only buy the women's stickers, if it wasn't for these new albums they'd not have collected or supported the hobby we love.

But I get both sides of the story, I really do as women's football needed manipulating to get it into it's current position - hey I wish my favourite sport (Speedway) would be given a push by the establishment or a billionaire would come along like in Darts as all it is doing is heading to a semi professional sport in the UK!

More stickers is always good and tbh there's a lot of albums I don't collect now so it's always a choice for what we collect, we're quite lucky to have so many albums still and long may it continue!

Edit: No idea why it shows a Poland flag on my profile today, I'm sat in the depths of Northamptonshire typing this!

 

[dantzig]

So I'm wrong, at LCFC you don't need a men's season ticket to get the great price, you can get a season ticket for £42 for the women's team but I think there are other discounts to be had.

An afternoon watching football in a great stadium is always good

I don't think anyone is necessarily wrong in this thread and we shouldn't discount differing view points because it does not fit in with our thinking

I haven't been to a women's game yet but I'm sure I will do one day

If I can add a story I would like to add that I lost a lot of support for the PL men's seeing the players utterly not interested in the supporters. Basically the PL clubs no longer represents the local community and I fell out with my team.

So after I lost a lot of love for the club that I loved so much, I reduced my visits to almost nothing... then one match I'm jogging back from the ground and I see an LCFC fan (down's syndrome boy) with his family member and it made me snap right out of any resentment in a second.

That club I started to dislike is his World, he may not care about players earning stupid money like I did, he had just seen his team lose and I wanted them to win again just for him and to win for nobody else but him.

It's the same with women's football, my 14 year old son's friend plays in a girls team and is doing very well. She's got no interest in school but this has captured her. I hear she's very good.

One of my nieces plays too but is 135 miles away so I hope we'll get to watch her play over Christmas.

This is their world and having the sticker album is another great step into what is really a shrinking market (stickers that is).

Maybe it will help revive parts of the market and I've spoken to a few female collectors that only buy the women's stickers, if it wasn't for these new albums they'd not have collected or supported the hobby we love.

But I get both sides of the story, I really do as women's football needed manipulating to get it into it's current position - hey I wish my favourite sport (Speedway) would be given a push by the establishment or a billionaire would come along like in Darts as all it is doing is heading to a semi professional sport in the UK!

More stickers is always good and tbh there's a lot of albums I don't collect now so it's always a choice for what we collect, we're quite lucky to have so many albums still and long may it continue!

Edit: No idea why it shows a Poland flag on my profile today, I'm sat in the depths of Northamptonshire typing this!

Lovely post Rob... Let's hope that "snap" has encouraged you again to support Leicester (they've been great in the championship!).

Those stories should be shared more as we need to pay more attention to the human factor rather than speaking always about money.

Much have been said here and it's been a healthy discussion, as expected from our community.

Looking forward to see this album and hopefully be another boost for the women football.

P.S. - You're still polish though

 

[Jamiepr74]

I just wish Panini would give us the 1980s style albums we had in UK that covered all 4 leagues + Scotland too, which could give plenty of room for women's football too.

Aaaaah Rob the glory days of the 1980's collections.....I echo your sentiment....sadly we know that it will never happen again!